Brexit the Movie : Taken from: https://vimeo.com/166378572

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Comment by Adam on May 31, 2016 at 9:18

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear enough that:

  1. I'm in no way opposed to debate or saying that there's needs to be balance, nor am I saying anything particular about the EU debate.
  2. I'm not attacking Joe (challenging behaviour or actions is not the same as dissing a person).

What I am hoping is that we can look at the source of the video, their agenda and past actions, and decide that to use their video is beyond the pale because of the deeper and dangerous agenda it is supporting (i.e. it's not about leaving the EU or being neo-liberal, but about the core agendas and past actions of ex-RCP/Spiked/Living Marxism).  I would hope we'd say the same thing if for example the far-right produced a video about all the community work they were doing (& didn't mention their racism etc).

Comment by kevin Frayne on May 28, 2016 at 19:58

If people wish to vent their most passionate and virile opposition to an ideology on one side of an equilibrium you must really first look at both sides of an argument. Myself being the vessel of this disputed link I can only give an apology that I  have tried in vain to discover an equal in entirety to balance the field. Attacking someone who I know to be a sincere and balanced person on grounds of being bias holds no weight here. I must and do agree 100% on Brens comments and would appeal as we all would for footage with equal clout, I would welcome it. 

Comment by Bren Cook on May 28, 2016 at 13:28

I've had my eye of this brief debate for a while and I thought I'd chip in my two penneths worth. First thought...Anyone can put up their views on NatCAN. People can then oppose them or add to them.We can have really lively debate and dissent, all most polite of course. Second thought...NatCAN hasn't the BBC's responsibility to be balanced. If there is balance it's brought about by members providing it. I'm busy trying to find a video that proposes Britain should leave the planet but alas there isn't one. So what I'm proposing is that Adam finds a video and posts it, or anything that counters the arguments put up by Joe's video. That's how NatCan gets balance because no one that works on the site behind the scenes has any editorial powers apart from the offensive, racist, sexist, homophobic stuff being taken down, often at members requests.

Comment by Adam on May 27, 2016 at 11:50

So if I sent a video about why women shouldn't own land/vote, why slavery should exist or something equally out-of-order, you'd also post it!!  That's no justification of leaving something like this on NatCAN. 

Please take a moment to read some of what I've written, or follow up the links, so you can see who's agenda is being promoted through this video.  I hope you'll then agree that that is not something we want to help put out there

The man behind this is dangerous and pushes such out-of-order nonsense (from the LM Network):

http://powerbase.info/index.php/Martin_Durkin

http://45storm.weebly.com/joe-blog/the-truth-behind-sense-about-sci...

http://www.spinwatch.org/index.php/issues/climate/item/4210-climate...

A few excerpts:

The LM network is a loosely constituted network of individuals and organisations sharing an extreme libertarian and anti-environmentalist ideology.  The principal LM themes, support for economic development and freedom from regulation, objectively benefit corporate interests. Thus the larger and more established LM-linked organisations seek and receive corporate sponsorship, either directly or via PR companies or free enterprise think tanks.

Comment by joe taylor on May 27, 2016 at 11:24

This is the government paper 'The process for withdrawing from the European Union'

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_dat...

It's 25 pages long and I've only had time to read the conclusions.

I put the Brexit video up because one of our members sent it in. Nobody has sent in anything that pushes the 'Remain' argument yet though point 5.12 from the conclusions of the government paper above is pretty emphatic:

It is important that the risk this presents is understood. It adds, in the Government’s view, to the compelling case for staying in a reformed EU on the secure new terms on offer. These offer the UK a special status and the best of both worlds.

Comment by Adam on May 26, 2016 at 16:11

That's exactly the reason that there may not be an equivalent that I would not have put this up on the site till I'd found it, for reasons of balance.

In any case, if it were possible to find the equivalent dangerous nutty nonsense (I don't mean to pro-Leave) on the Remain side would be worrying.

Joe, you've not answered my concerns in any way about:

a) posting this video in particular,
b) without any balance.

Perhaps next you'll be posting Aaron Banks' (Daily Express, UKIP and Leave funder) ideas!! - that's a joke, not a suggestion ;-)

Comment by joe taylor on May 26, 2016 at 14:22

Not been able to find the equivalent/counter-balance from the Remain camp yet Adam. If you, or anyone else, know of one would you please put it up, or send me the link and I'll do it for you.

Cheers

Comment by Adam on May 26, 2016 at 13:08

Please at the very very least post the counter-balance to this if you're going to put this propagandist tripe up on our site! 

Dangerous simplistic nonsense from fanatical neo-liberals, climate deniers, Liverpudlian-smearers and small-minded racists. 

And that's before you take a glance at the director - part of the notorious ex-RCP/Spiked/Living Marxism crazies behind Sense about Science and other front organisations, using misleading & factually inaccurate claims to push a really mad ideological line that also serves the vested interests of multinationals and worse.

All this is completely against any values that might set this forum apart (& please don't chuck in any red herrings of Freeze Peach!).

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